For the Season 1 finale of the The Herbein Conversation’s Fraud Fighters series, host Debbi Fetter is joined by returning guest Julie Mixtacki to explore a fast-growing and highly manipulative scam known as Pig Butchering.
These scams that often target older adults blend romance and investment fraud and use social media and messaging apps to gain trust before convincing victims to invest in fake cryptocurrency platforms.
Listen now to close out Season 1 and prepare yourself for one of today’s most dangerous financial scams. We’ll be back this fall with Season 2 of Fraud Fighters, featuring more expert guests, new topics and additional fraud prevention strategies.
Debbi S. Fetter: Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of The Herbein Conversation Podcast, where we dive into some of the most pressing issues in today’s workplace. I’m Debbi Fetter, Partner and Managing Director of our firm’s Risk Management practice and host of Fraud Fighters, your go-to series for the latest fraud and cybersecurity tips and trends.
In our previous episode, “Elder Fraud on the Rise: How to Spot & Prevent Scams”, we
covered a wide range of schemes targeting seniors, including an introduction to a
relatively new and disturbing type of fraud called "Pig Butchering".
Today, we’re taking a deeper dive into this complex scam that’s wreaking financial and emotional havoc on victims - particularly amongst our elderly population, who are increasingly being targeted.
Joining me again is Julie Mixtacki, Senior Manager and returning guest to the
podcast. Welcome back, Julie.
Julie Mixtacki: Thanks for having me back, Debbi. I’m glad we’re covering this one in more detail. Pig Butchering scams are gaining momentum fast, and people need to be aware of how they work.
Debbi S. Fetter: Definitely for those hearing this term for the first time, “Pig Butchering” refers to a type of investment scam where fraudsters build trust with victims over time, often through dating apps, social media, or messaging platforms. The goal is to “fatten up”, if you will, the victim emotionally and financially before tricking them into transferring funds into fake investments, usually cryptocurrency.
Julie J. Mixtacki: Exactly. The fraudsters often pose a successful investors or professionals. They take their time, sometimes weeks or even months, grooming the victim with daily contact and flattery. Then they introduce what they claim is a quote unquote, hot investment opportunity. It looks legitimate and they take advantage of their relationship with the victim to draw them in using fake websites, dashboards, showing fake returns, even customer service lines.
Debbi S. Fetter: Legitimate is right. These fraudsters have gotten so good at passing these fakes as the real thing that, according to a 2023 FinCEN (Financial Crimes Enforcement Network) alert, these scams have led to billions in losses in the US alone, and they often involve criminal organizations that operate internationally as well. Even more troubling to me is that some of the perpetrators may themselves be victims of labor trafficking, forced to carry out these schemes.
Julie, with such a troubling situation, let's talk about what people should watch out for. What are the red flags?
Julie J. Mixtacki: Well, there are quite a few, and they're often subtle. But here are some of the most common red flags.
And it's important to note that older adults are especially vulnerable here. Many are less familiar with cryptocurrency or evolving scam tactics, and scammers exploit that unfamiliarity along with emotional manipulation to devastating effect.
Debbi S. Fetter: Scary, but excellent points. I'd also add that victims sometimes realize something's wrong when they try to withdraw their profits, and all of a sudden, the platform stops responding, or they're told they owe taxes or fees to get their money out. That's often when they discover the entire thing was a ruse, correct?
Julie J. Mixtacki: Yes. And by then the scammer has usually disappeared or even tried to scam the victim again under a different name. It's a very cruel cycle. It's important to remember that victim’s information, especially when fraud has been successfully perpetrated, is often sold between multiple fraudsters, perpetuating revictimization over and over again. The emotional damage is just as severe as the financial loss.
Debbi S. Fetter: Absolutely. And heartbreaking for our elderly friends. And on that note, let's pivot briefly to what financial institutions and employers should be aware of. I understand that FinCEN's alert also encourages banks to look for larger, unusual crypto purchases, especially from accounts that don't normally engage in those types of transactions.
They also recommend training frontline staff to recognize distressed customers who may be under the influence of a scam, and to establish escalation procedures when something seems off.
If a customer asks for a large sum of cash or to send a large wire out a pattern for their normal activity, it's important for the frontline to ask simple questions regarding the purpose of the transaction. One question can be enough to stop the scam.
Julie J. Mixtacki: Yes. And for families, especially those caring for older adults, having open conversations about online relationships and money is vital. The more we talk about this, the more likely people are to recognize the signs early.
Debbi S. Fetter: Excellent points. Our listeners can certainly count on us to continue talking about it. But before we wrap up this episode, I'd like to go over a few quick takeaways for audience.
Julie, thank you for joining me again and helping shed light on this disturbing but important topic of “Pig Butchering”.
Julie J. Mixtacki: Thanks for having me, Debbi. I hope this episode helps protect someone out there from becoming the next victim.
Debbi S. Fetter: I couldn't agree more. And to our listeners, stay informed, stay alert and if you missed our first episode on elder fraud, we encourage you to go back and give it a listen. You can find Fraud Fighters episodes on our website, herbein.com, Apple or Spotify.
Thank you again for tuning in, and remember, keep up the fight fraud fighters!